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Re: Paying for irc... haha. #54392 14/10/03 12:24 PM
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ReactoR Offline
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i hope that one day i would have the money to pay khaled for his work, and for making us all happy with his exellent IRC client. btw, as a network administrator, i dont allow warez as well. I hope khaled will change DCC protocol soon to prevent it(iroffer is working with DCC.)

Re: Paying for irc... haha. #54393 14/10/03 02:27 PM
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KingTomato Offline
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On that topic, the best way to safeguard from illegal file trading, etc is on the server level--not client. Yes, you may find earlier at one time I said mirc should, but I have since thought about it. mIRC adding things to its software would be both ineffective as well as bad for "business?".

Lets examine both ideas. Khaled goes ahead an adds the build in ptoection against illegal filesharing, and everyone's happy--right? Wrong, those who do fileshare will stay with lower versions of mirc. They just wont upgrade, finding they can share illegal "warez" just as well with version 5~6.x, then with the new and improved 7.xwith filesharing protections! If they don't prefer staying with an older version, they could just switch clients. You would need all clients to incorperate protections for it to be 100% effective.

How about the other alternative, where Khaled adds the protections, then people are outraged. Everyone announces "mIRC breaks privacy act"where users should have a right to what they do and dont't share. Many become angered, and for no reason (like they almost always are) mirc.com gets DDoS'd and is forced to take either legal action, or shut down.

I mean both are a worst case scenario, but not far from the truth. Adding a DCC illegal file transfer protection would be like takig down a tank with a BB gun. Sure you can make as many shots as you want, but its not going to do any real harm. As ++The Mentor++ said, "You may stop this individual, but you can't stop us all... after all, we're all alike." He was talking about hackers (not crackers--i don't want to be corrected by the one whom finds in neccisery to rename freeware) but it's still the general idea. You can take down a small portion of the whole picute, but you'll never get rid of all of it.


-KingTomato
Re: Paying for irc... haha. #54394 14/10/03 10:43 PM
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having read codemasters thread on why no patch for 6.03, I come to the conclusion that khaled is ignorant. Here is why.

1 - I havent seen a post on here by him, instead he hides behind the board admin and moderators.
2 - Who are the beta testers are they just friends of his?
3 - He tends to say in the release notes "as requested blah blah feature added", who requests this, I no know one who has requested the stuff he adds and no one on here seems to have requested it either so I come to the conclusion its his personal group of friends who make the requests.
4 - Ignores requests on here, why no patch for 6.03? 6.1 should have been 7.0 as it was a major gui change.
5 - having come to the conclusion mirc is a program he has written for personal use and for the use of his friends, which he charges for to hope to get cash for, then I will never pay for it, but if I seen khaled posting on here answering queries then I might change my view. (he would be coding this anyway without anyone paying dont be fooled into he relies on the income)

Am i wrong? feel free to correct me khaled, but I only expect board mods to be trying to correct me.

Re: Paying for irc... haha. #54395 14/10/03 11:08 PM
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Mentality Offline
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Quote:
1 - I havent seen a post on here by him, instead he hides behind the board admin and moderators.


Well, most people probably answer users before him anyway. He spends a lot of time working on mIRC, and I'm sure you can appreciate how many emails he has to sift through. He does, occasionally, find the time to answer queries, but I've noticed it tends to be more in the Bugs section etc where it's more related to the actual mIRC client rather than helping with IRC in general. I'm also sure he knows his opinion would only be met with argument after argument, therefore, draining more of his time in replying - and let's face it, with the stubborn people that hang around here, he would never win.

Quote:
2 - Who are the beta testers are they just friends of his?


To be honest, I have no idea who the Beta Testers are. But then again, thinking about it, who else would you have testing unreleased versions of mIRC? It has to be people who Khaled, or high-up mIRC team members like Krejt, truly and deeply trust - otherwise, they could have people going off telling anyone and everyone what new features are coming up.

Quote:
3 - He tends to say in the release notes "as requested blah blah feature added", who requests this, I no know one who has requested the stuff he adds and no one on here seems to have requested it either so I come to the conclusion its his personal group of friends who make the requests.


I rarely frequent the Requests board, usually only when I have nothing else to do. A lot of the time it's minor little requests that are obviously not going to be at the top of his list..like changing borders of edit boxes or something silly. Anyway, I'm sure he takes a mixture of some of the requests from that board, and his personal friends requests, and then adds something he'd like to himself in his client.

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4 - Ignores requests on here, why no patch for 6.03? 6.1 should have been 7.0 as it was a major gui change.


See my argument for this here.

Quote:
5 - having come to the conclusion mirc is a program he has written for personal use and for the use of his friends, which he charges for to hope to get cash for, then I will never pay for it, but if I seen khaled posting on here answering queries then I might change my view. (he would be coding this anyway without anyone paying dont be fooled into he relies on the income)


The first mIRC released were in fact for himself. He released it to the public to see what other people thought of it, and it became extremely popular, and still is. Instead of just never paying for it, how about just never using it? I am sick to death of seeing these people whinge and whine about Khaled, and not pay for their copy (and then moan about the dialogue box) - and then have the audassity to use his program, as if it's some human right! And actually, it does cost money to continue making mIRC, and if you had investigated even more, mIRC is the way he makes a living (perhaps other things too, but mIRC plays a big role in his yearly pay salary).

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Am i wrong? feel free to correct me khaled, but I only expect board mods to be trying to correct me.


Yes you are. Khaled may or may not post here, I hope he does, but if he doesn't it's probably because of the reasons above. Remember, Khaled is in general a very quiet person anyway - he doesn't accept interviews or lucrative deals to sell mIRC etc etc, he keeps himself to himself. It's fine by me, plenty of people are knowledgeable enough to answer you.

Happy chatting (with mIRC)

Regards,


Mentality/Chris
Re: Paying for irc... haha. #54396 14/10/03 11:15 PM
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Quote:
To be honest, I have no idea who the Beta Testers are. But then again, thinking about it, who else would you have testing unreleased versions of mIRC? It has to be people who Khaled, or high-up mIRC team members like Krejt, truly and deeply trust - otherwise, they could have people going off telling anyone and everyone what new features are coming up.

<sarcasm>
Yes you're right! The horror, the horror! God help mIRC if users happen to know what will be in the new version! Khaled should petition governments all around the world to declare the new features of mIRC to be classified top secret information!
</sarcasm>

Remind me again why it is such a horrible thing if people know what new features mIRC will have? It seems like most other clients have no problem telling their users what to expect in new versions.

Re: Paying for irc... haha. #54397 14/10/03 11:24 PM
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Education leads to revolution.

Re: Paying for irc... haha. #54398 14/10/03 11:38 PM
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Heh, yah know? You might be right. Someone way saying there was a connection between mIRC and Islam, well what about between mIRC and communism?

Education is a weapon whose effects depend on who holds it in his hands and at whom it is aimed. -- Stalin

Those who cast the votes decide nothing. Those who count the votes decide everything. -- Stalin

A lie told often enough becomes the truth. -- Lenin

Those seem to sum up Khaled's ideology of mIRC pretty nicely.

Well what do I say? Lets use the communist mantra against mIRC! To reword the motto, "mIRC users of the world unite! You have nothing to lose but the chains of a shoddy IRC client!"

Re: Paying for irc... haha. #54399 15/10/03 01:26 AM
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well the point I was getting down to is this, I can easily compare this program to freeware programs where they accept donations, but not to other shareware programs.

Normally when you buy shareware there is other benefits such as official support and possible exclusive use of beta software, with mirc I dont see any advantage for the registered user over anyone else. Yes there is morals for buying what you should be contractually buying, but is the author having morals for classifying this as shareware?

I seriously cannot understand the decision of such closed beta testing, there is nothing wrong with knowing what future new features are going to be, but I can see the issues that have been raised with closed beta testing, there is obviously a huge rejection to the new gui layout both on here and on all the irc networks im on, had the beta test been more open khaled would have known this before 6.1 was released.

I hope my points of view are taken upon.

Re: Paying for irc... haha. #54400 15/10/03 02:05 AM
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KingTomato Offline
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To answer one question, Khaled doesn't only have close friend beta test. Though I can't back this up with facts or sources, You can trust that I'm correct.


-KingTomato
Re: Paying for irc... haha. #54401 15/10/03 06:41 AM
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Quote:
Those seem to sum up Khaled's ideology of mIRC pretty nicely.


You are clearly ignorant of the Communist reality. Although born in the UK, I live in a country which was until 1989 a genuine Communist state, and I can assure you that there is no relation whatsoever between that system of government and the way mIRC is produced, tested, marketed, sold and used.

Indeed, I personally find such an analogy to be deeply offensive - as, I suspect, would anyone who really understands the crimes and brutality of those regimes.

I very much doubt that Khaled would want to send anyone to the gulags, although I could probably understand this desire on the part of board users/moderators when faced with someone who seems to have nothing better to do than send dozens of moaning messages just because they aren't getting their own way.

Quote:
Lets use the communist mantra against mIRC! To reword the motto, "mIRC users of the world unite! You have nothing to lose but the chains of a shoddy IRC client!"


You are further displaying your ignorance - Marxism's call for workers of the world to unite was adopted by the Communists, but despite the propaganda Communism developed on from Marxism-Leninism and should not be confused with the pure form of it, notwithstanding the compulsory teaching of Marxism-Leninism in schools. (Why else was Trostky murdered?)

There was really NO need for you to post such an insulting message, especially when you are so clearly unaware of the real implications of what you are saying.

PastMaster


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Re: Paying for irc... haha. #54402 15/10/03 06:54 AM
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Mentality Offline
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Well, personally, I find it much more fun to be able to explore the client myself when it's released, and then after say 24 hours of looking around, I go and look at the versions.txt.

And Khaled has always done this, he has never released information about up-and-coming mIRC's, it's just like a tradition now...please don't rant about how this is a business and you need to keep with the times and not tradition blah blah blah, I don't need my head slamming against my keyboard with boredom yet again.

I haven't seen you post one positive comment since the release of 6.1, and it's just getting monotonous now, why don't you go and grow up and get another Klient (*pun intended*) instead of whining here constantly? At the start of this entire tirade I thought you would actually have the maturity to do so, but now you're just acting like one of these lamers that we see almost every day who spam the boards etc etc...*snore*

You've made your point of view perfectly clear, and now to top it all off, offending someone in the process of doing so. Everybody has the picture, you don't need to keep repeating yourself. The words may be different, the foundation meaning of what you're saying remains the same though, and it's boring smile

Regards,


Mentality/Chris
Re: Paying for irc... haha. #54403 15/10/03 07:01 AM
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And he wonders why his posts get deleted.


Never compare yourself to others - they're more screwed up than you think.
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