mIRC Home    About    Download    Register    News    Help

Print Thread
ATTENTION: Khaled Mardan-Bey #82867 13/05/04 06:21 AM
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 1
P
phoenix1840 Offline OP
Mostly harmless
OP Offline
Mostly harmless
P
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 1
ATTENTION: Khaled Mardan-Bey
“The Author (and part-time Human Bean)
I've also had to learn to accept criticism, which is hard for something that's personal; but mIRC wouldn't be where it is today without help from many people over the years.”

Khaled,
Why does 99.999 % of your rooms, servers/rooms people are so cold including the privileged operators.
I have tried to get help with your program into many, many and most of your help room’s possible, and nobody answers or offers help, including the operators ( @ ) .

I am so disappointed that I do not have intention to upgrade towards any latest versions (mIRC 6.14 ).

I recommend major cleanup in the operators. Maybe we’d get some help!

Sadly phoenix1840


Re: ATTENTION: Khaled Mardan-Bey #82868 13/05/04 06:52 AM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 3,127
P
ParaBrat Offline
Hoopy frood
Offline
Hoopy frood
P
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 3,127
Please understand that Khaled does not have control or affiliation with any network, their IRCops, channels on any network or the ops of those channels. Khaled doesnt choose the ops on any #mIRC's either.

I'm sorry that your experiences in getting help have been unpleasant, but honest, there are a lot of good help channels and ops who spend a lot (if not most) of their time online helping ppl. Many of the ppl who spend time helping here on this forum, also help in an assortment of channels. If you dont get an answer right away, it could be that all the ops are busy helping others, or are away from their computers at the time. Check in the help channel for the network you go to (usually listed in their Msg Of The Day, to read it, in any mIRC window type /motd or look on their website) for approved help channels.

A few tips:
-dont use all CAPS, thats considered shouting and rude
-read the topic or any rules for the channel when you enter
-dont just keep saying HELP, ask your question clearly in the channel
-answer any questions the ops ask as best you can so they can clarify what the problem is
-dont keep repeating, be patient
-don't flood by posting multiple two word sentences, or huge scripts
-be willing to spend some time reading to help yourself. dont get angry if an op refers you to a section of the help file, to a thread here, to a website that has the answer you seek, gives you a command for services info, refers you to a channel that is better able to help you or refuses to help you engage an illegal activity or something against their policies.


ParaBrat @#mIRCAide DALnet
Re: ATTENTION: Khaled Mardan-Bey #82869 13/05/04 06:53 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 428
P
PastMaster Offline
Fjord artisan
Offline
Fjord artisan
P
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 428
Quote:
of your rooms, servers/rooms people


Khaled has written a client (program) that allows you, the user, to connect to any of the thousands of networks out there that use the IRC protocol. There are lots of *other* programs that allow you to connect to the very same networks and channels.

Khaled did not invent IRC (as it says in the FAQ that you have obviously read).

Please understand, therefore, that Khaled is NOT RESPONSIBLE for any networks or servers, and has no control over them, or the people in them. Nor are the authors of any of the other clients that allow access to the networks.

Quote:
nobody answers or offers help, including the operators


Sadly, this is increasingly a problem on IRC these days, even in so-called Help channels. (Until recently I was a channel op in a large help channel - I left for this very reason).

Fortunately, you DO have an alternative - ask questions on this message board! Or try the help channels on a different network.

Quote:
I do not have intention to upgrade towards any latest versions


Well that's probably not the best attitude, because it means you will miss out on bug fixes and extra features. Don't forget, once you have registered mIRC all upgrades are FREE forever!

Quote:
I recommend major cleanup in the operators. Maybe we'd get some help


I think a lot of people would agree, BUT Khaled is not the right person to tell. The only people who can change the operators in a channel are the channel operators themselves or the channel owner/founder (on networks supporting channel registration).

I am sure that we all understand your frustration - and that we have all faced similar problems in the past. Khaled, however, only wrote the software, he doesn't administer the networks... so he can't help you.

PastMaster


IRCnet & DALnet @#travelersinn
:-: IRC for fun and relaxation :-:
Re: ATTENTION: Khaled Mardan-Bey #82870 13/05/04 07:13 AM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 3,127
P
ParaBrat Offline
Hoopy frood
Offline
Hoopy frood
P
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 3,127
"I am sure that we all understand your frustration - and that we have all faced similar problems in the past."

Good point, and sad but true. Its very frustrating when you face rude ppl, whether IRC or IRL. We've all had contact with some ppl who just cant be bothered, are on some power trip or who must be having an incredibly bad day. In fairness, ops in help channels do seem to face more than their share of rude users or troublemakers. On the other side of the coin, some ppl forget that they were new once too.

Even tho the bad somtimes stands out more in our minds, luckily there are lots of ppl who DO try their best to help, as we can all also attest to. I still fondly remember ppl from many years ago who took the time to help me when i was a newbie.


ParaBrat @#mIRCAide DALnet
Re: ATTENTION: Khaled Mardan-Bey #82871 13/05/04 08:34 AM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 28
P
puterfixer Offline
Ameglian cow
Offline
Ameglian cow
P
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 28
phoenix18:

You have joined #mirchelp on Undernet on May 11th at 8:16:54 CET and told us that when you try to download an mp3, an ad tells you to get OmenServe script if you want to serve files, and then you asked if you should download it. One of our helpers who was online at that time was already engaged in a conversation with another person, but he answered you promptly, one minute and 10 seconds after the first message and two other messages 10 respectively 24 seconds after your actual question. Then you asked which serving script to use in order to download files; the helper told you 30 seconds later that we do not help with mp3 trading. A few minutes later, you thanked the helper and left.

Half an hour later, you return asking for help on activating a script you have downloaded and installed. After barely two minutes, your patience runs out and you type, and I quote:
Quote:
<phoenix18> GAWD WE DON'T MUCH HELP HERE. WHAT THE USE OF A ROOM AS THIS


At that time, the channel manager (called "founder" on some networks) stepped in and answered your questions thoroughly: that you nee to read the help file of the script for instructions about installing and using it, that IRC doesn't have rooms - it has channels, and then reiterated to you that:

Quote:
<@Eenie> phoenix18 since 99.9% of mp3's, videos and software traded on irc are copyrighted, that qualifies as warez, which is illegal. For more info, check out http://www.irchelp.org/irchelp/security/warez.html


Your answer was that it's not illegal in Canada, to which the manager told you it is. Then, you quit.

You returned in the evening, on May 11 at 23:28:13 CET and asked if someone can help you with a script because everyone is asleep in the "scriphelp room". Not knowing what you are asking about, another helper suggested another scripting help channel. You left again after less than 3 minutes.

The next day, May 13 at 8:29:41 CET, you joined #mirchelp again to post the URL of this thread you have started and left immediately. You returned after 3 minutes, when the channel manager asked you to stop pasting URLs in channel. You engaged in a conversation with the manager and another helper which explained you how help works, but you didn't seem to like the explanations and left.

Now, let's see what you did wrong.

First: sharing and downloading copyrighted materials is illegal in most countries of the world. Even if a country doesn't have a copyright-related law, there are international laws on copyright protections which are considered above national laws as importance, and most countries of the world accepted these international laws on copyright. Canada has a copyright law, I'm sure a lawyer there can tell you the number and year of that Act. Music, movies, software - they are all copyrighted materials. Therefore, sharing or downloading mp3s online without obtaining a license to do so from the copyright holder is a violation of the copyright law and classifies as illegal activity. Help channels are not allowed to provide any help with such file trading, and you were told that in two occasions.

On the other hand, what you typed in the channel can be identified with your IP address and date which, together, act like a signature, allowing the law enforcement agencies to identify you directly; what you said is considered a written statement from you in which you declare by own will that you are trying to do something illegal - in this case, to download copyrighted materials without the legal right to do so, right which is obtained by paying for it and it's called a license. Every audio CD has a license printed on it, which gives you the right to listen to it under certain terms. Internet Providers make it clear in the subscription contract that the customer is forbidden to use the Internet connection provided by the ISP to engage in any illegal activity; go on, read your contract with Rogers.com, even the "terms and conditions" in fine print at the end. Now, if I was 100% ethical, I would contact your Internet Service Provider immediately and announce them that you are in fact using the internet connection to download and possibly share copyrighted materials, in direct infringement of the contract you have with them and with copyright laws. They should block your account immediately and notify the authorities on your illegal conduct. So, you will end up with a subpoena in the mail and even the police at your door to take your computer in custody as proof for downloading copyrighted music. I'll let you go, this time; you didn't know what you are doing is wrong or someone might have told you it's ok, but now you do. Your mistake was forgiven, provided that you learn from it and stop pursuing illegal downloads. On your next mistake, my e-mail to the ISP and the Police will be prompt; I've done it so often, that I already have a template e-mail for it, just need to fill in your nickname, IP address and attach logs.

Second error: helpers don't get paid for what they do. All help online is conducted by volunteers, they are not under the supervision of Mr. Khaled Mardam-Bey or any other authority. We help from the goodness of our hearts, but we also have a real life, work, school and other problems, so we cannot stay online to provide instant help 24/7. People looking for help will need to be patient and come back at a later time, when helpers might be at the keyboard. The requirements for getting free help are: to be patient until someone answers (it can take even a few hours, but if you want free help you have to wait), to be polite, courteous and say at least "thank you" for the service these people have provided you for free. That's all we expect from you.

In your specific case, you were answered promptly on each occasion, however you decided to ignore the help. If you think you know better, why did you join the channel in the first place? The help provided to you was accurate, given the scarce details you provided in some instances. You were not patient enough to wait for an answer. Your attitude towards this whole matter was to come here and post a complaint and engage in a fight with the helpers for not giving you the answers you wanted.

Last edited by Khaled; 13/05/04 11:36 AM.
Re: ATTENTION: Khaled Mardan-Bey #82872 13/05/04 10:13 AM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 3,127
P
ParaBrat Offline
Hoopy frood
Offline
Hoopy frood
P
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 3,127
puterfixer: well said, and a classic example of the amount of patience some channels and ops display, along with an equally classic example of how NOT to behave when seeking help. Altho phoenix1480 didnt specify your channel in his post, if he posted the url of this thread in your channel its certainly understandable you would feel his post applied to your channel.

phoenix1840: This thread is not going to get into a he said/she said/they said debate. If you have any problem with a specific channel or op, then you need to resolve it with them directly. From what i've seen tho, it would seem that at least one channel has taken a good bit of time to answer you. Whether you liked the answers or not isnt an issue nor reason to belittle in general all the many ppl who take the time to help the best they can. I'm not taking sides or making accusations, but i'd like to point out:
- the questions that puterfixer mentioned would have gotten the same answers in many help channels and here on this forum.
-the behavior described would get a user banned in many help channels


ParaBrat @#mIRCAide DALnet
Re: ATTENTION: Khaled Mardan-Bey #82873 13/05/04 10:21 AM
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 20
C
copericus Offline
Ameglian cow
Offline
Ameglian cow
C
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 20
Just like to add the behaviour mentioned about downloading copyright materials such as MP3's would have got you a ban on some networks too. Mirc is a CHAT prog after all is it not?