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Mirc Help File ? #27654 02/06/03 06:05 PM
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Adrenalin Offline OP
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I whant to translate the mirc help file in my language ..
How i can do that more good&easyly ?
Also i whant to ask about the original help file .. It so old .. (hlp) it don't develop since 1995 (the help program) .. I think need to rewrite the old help file to the new Microsoft HTML Help (CHM) ..
I just finde some helpful link ..


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Re: Mirc Help File ? #27655 02/06/03 06:15 PM
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Is this what you're looking for?


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Re: Mirc Help File ? #27656 02/06/03 06:50 PM
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Adrenalin Offline OP
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At that page i found only "Download, Install and Setup instructions:" .. Whant to translate all mirc help file smile

Also found a old discution about the Mirc Help File ..
The Chm is BETTER ! If i whant to found ex. "While Loops
" in the help file .. I need to scrol a lot ..


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Re: Mirc Help File ? #27657 02/06/03 09:30 PM
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EMAIL (SMTP) is so old and awful, I think we need 72pt font and background images and midis in our email... how about HTML?

.HLP format is a fine, simple, and almost certainly compatible format on all windows machines. It uses very little resources, and zero room for exploitation. I only wish there were more, easier to use, and readily available .HLP writing programs. I also wish the mIRC help file were more like the Win32API help file *drool*.

- Raccoon


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Re: Mirc Help File ? #27658 02/06/03 10:11 PM
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codemastr Offline
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Quote:

EMAIL (SMTP) is so old and awful, I think we need 72pt font and background images and midis in our email... how about HTML?


If I'm not mistaken, the majority of email clients do support HTML email, so I'm not sure I see your point.

Re: Mirc Help File ? #27659 02/06/03 10:23 PM
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That statement is laced with cynicism and sarcasm. It's human nature to make things so complicated that the beauty of its simplicity becomes lost (or stolen).

It's my understanding that a new "Email Worm" has been unleashed upon the sheep of the internet who use these newfangle HTML Email Clients, that begin with the letter O. This makes how many Email Worms since the new millennium? This would never have occurred if SMTP were left Simple.

Leave Good Enough Alone.


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Re: Mirc Help File ? #27660 02/06/03 11:06 PM
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Not much point in blaming a programme that has been around for about as long as HTML. If you want to blame someone for the worms have a dig at two things:

1. The people that make the worms.
2. The people who refuse to use AV software.

In some misguided belief that those who don't use AV software say "It's okay, I know what I am doing, I've never used AV software and I've never been nailed by ANY virii", I can only utters the words "How would you know this?". AV software, by it's nature, cannot stop new virii on day one. But on day two or three it can surely make a very big difference.

Then there is the authors of trojans. They don't do it because every man and his dog uses M$ Outlook. They do it because if Outlook wasn't there then there'd be another welcome mat for them.

Blaming Micro$oft is just a cop-out.


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Re: Mirc Help File ? #27661 03/06/03 12:21 AM
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codemastr Offline
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So let me see if I understand your sarcasm... The advancement of HTML email, which millions of people use and love, was used in a sarcastic manner to mean something that should not be implemented? Ok then here is my cynicism:

Text based OSes are so old and awful, I think we need full color GUIs, video and voice interfaces, the ability to run numerous programs at once, etc.
<explanation of cynicism since no one (not even I) can understand it>
I mean we all know that once GUIs were added to OSes, thats when the bugs really started. You didn't have too many bugs when everything was incredibly simple, you had it when it got more advanced, therefore what we really need to do is go back to the text only days when everything ran stable.
</explanation>

When things get more complex, problems arise. When I first got my DOS based PC I said that was "good enough," based on your quote that means we should have just stopped there because most people considered that "good enough." Most people considered the Ford Model T with it's maximum speed of ~10mph "good enough." Most people considered the ability to travel by road, rail, and water "good enough" so flight was not needed. Most people considered everything to be "good enough" at one time or another, so if we take your saying to the extreme I wouldn't be sitting here typing this on a computer, I'd have a letter carried by horseback to the coast where it would then be transported on a ship to your country and then it would be again transported by horseback to you, such a system was "good enough" in the 1700s. Even the concept of rubbing sticks together to start a fire to produce heat and light was "good enough" for the cavemen. That doesn't mean we should be sitting hear starting fires and camping out under our huts made of mud and animal skins. Everything was "good enough" until something newer and better came into being, therefore it negates your argument, NOTHING is EVER good enough, because once you think you found something that is, all it means is something thats better hasn't be invented yet. Just because you are happy with the system we have now doesn't mean we should stick with it simply because newer and better technologies will bring uncertainties.

Re: Mirc Help File ? #27662 03/06/03 12:25 AM
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Am I the only person who just plain prefers the overall feel of .HLP over .CHM?


Spelling mistakes, grammatical errors, and stupid comments are intentional.
Re: Mirc Help File ? #27663 03/06/03 12:31 AM
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I certainly don't enjoy the "feel" of it, it "feels" like an old wornout piece of software that needs to die a slow and painful death.

Re: Mirc Help File ? #27664 03/06/03 05:09 AM
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You make valid points about 'refusal to accept the mundane leads to the flashy improvements, which then also become mundane'.

But seriously, do you really think that technological improvement has made the world a better place?
We found out that trees both burnt and floated, so we cut them down as fuel and built ships. Then we explored and thats about where the trouble began. We went to other countries and decided "This isn't good enough", and accordingly changed their cultures by both violent and non-violent means. (Indians + Smallpox Blankets == genocide, Criminals + Australia == a rather silly idea in retrospect, and genocide following (strangely, it probably wasn't the criminals that did the most of it.)

Ok maybe it wasn't when we hacked down our first forest and noticed there was suddenly a lot more room for cows, maybe it was when people started EARNING MORE GOLD THAN PHYSICALLY EXISTED. We started passing around bits of paper with numbers on it and treating it as very rare and very valuable. Kinda stupid of us actually.

Why did we all do it? We like our psuedo gold. A lot. Once we got over the threshold of fire, shelter, food and water, we started making money to make our lives more comfortable. A bigger house, a new floor rug, a foolishly exspensive car which runs terribly and guzzles petrol. Why do we need it all? Well, so we can get more money. Are we really gaining much from it at all?

I like my playstation one (yes, its really old). Its a nice paperwieght and a console. But so long as I can eat, sleep, and drink in a nice warm place, I'm fairly content with life.

If you've seen fightclub you might know where I'm going. Cast off the shackles of society!

In reality, do you or I actually need a computer? No, its just been marketed so that we think we do. The big mistake was deciding that everyone needed one, not just scientists, governments and others who HAVE AN ACTUAL CRITICAL USE FOR THE FUNCTIONING OF A SOCIETY. Whne the PC came to everyone, I said ok. Soon it all changed. Thus the advent of buttons. I hate buttons. I really do.
*pant*

Edited:
Was this the most pointless post you ever saw?

Last edited by CloCkWeRX; 03/06/03 05:36 AM.
Re: Mirc Help File ? #27665 03/06/03 05:53 AM
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Ever heard the saying "hindsight is always 20/20?" Well it's true, when you look back and can see the chain of events that occurred it is pretty easy to see what caused things to happen. However, we aren't blessed with having hindsight until after the fact. You can't know what the ramifications of an action will be until you have taken the action. You can try and determine likely scenarios, but you won't always be correct. But, I believe in the majority of cases actions (at least in recent years) are generally made to better existence in general. For example, when it comes to saving the environment. Many nations have "endangered species" acts which protect certain animals under the law, in addition most nations frown on actions such as poaching. The slaughter and sale of such animals could potentially bring considerable income to a nation that changed its stance on such issues, but in the interest of ethics and morality, most nations have not. There are also things like protected land, for example in the US there is ANWR (Arctic National Wildlife Refuge) which is protected land, basically no one can touch it, and yes I know the status of this area is currently in question, but I feel like ignoring that fact for now. Civilized nations also have laws that promote peace, not violence. You are jailed for murder, not for being a Good Samaritan. Perhaps it's rather ethnocentric of me, but I believe the majority of the problems in the world are influenced by the major nations of the world, but primarily the actual problems are caused by the undeveloped nations. It isn't the US that is chopping down the rain forests, it is the indigenous peoples of that area, it isn't the US that is drilling everywhere for oil, it is organizations like OPEC. They may be influenced by money, but my point is that it is not the nations we would considered civilized that actually perform these acts. The civilized nations realized that the world is flawed and instead of just throwing up their hands and walking away, they strive to correct the problems. Having brought up the issue of oil, there are things like hydrogen fuel cells which from everything I've read run 99.99% clean, and since they are powered by water, we pretty much have as much as we could possibly ever need.

But as for technology, yes I do believe that at least in some respects it has made the world a better place. Consider medical science. Seeing as how you brought up Small Pox, I'll mention the fact that medical science has made it so Small Pox is no longer a threat. I personally would have been dead at the age of 8 if it weren't for medicine, medical science in my opinion has certainly done good for society as a whole, the only thing I could possibly bring up with medicine that would be negative would perhaps be methods of testing (animal testing), and issues such as abortion and assisted suicide. But, those aren't the major purpose for medicine, "do no harm" are very familiar words to most doctors. Other forms of technology also tie into this. To use a hypothetical scenario, assume mass media and mass transit do not exist. A scientist in China cures cancer. It may take months if not years for this message to spread all over the world, and it would be nearly impossible for treatment to reach the underdeveloped corners of the world. But with mass communications and transit, within seconds of this cure being produced, every major scientific organization in the world would know about it. Groups like the WHO would help make the treatment available in all parts of the world.

I do not disagree that technology has brought about negative things, but I'd like to think that the majority of people have good intentions for their actions and therefore I believe that the people who create such problems are the minority and all of mankind should not be judged based on them.

One oddity I saw in your comments though; when talking about the computer you say that goverments have a purpose for such things. I would say that in a rather basic sense governments are part of the problem. After all one of the things usually mentioned in Hobbes social contract theory is that goverments were created to protect against other governments. That is to wage war on others who threaten them. Even most sacred texts generally include justification for war, if not outright, then by example, such as in the Bible it says "though shalt not kill" but it also talks about how the Jews obtained their rights through wars that God approved of, there is even a certain passage where God drowns a bunch of Egyptian soldiers. I would contend that goverments are the problem. I'm not suggesting that we should dismantle all governments, more like attempt to improve them. Again it ties into we should except what is "good enough" we should always strive for what is perfect. We may never actually get to the point of a utopian society, but we can at least try. And on that note I've just noticed how much I've actually typed and therefore I think I'll end here smile

Re: Mirc Help File ? #27666 03/06/03 06:00 AM
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holy sh*t -- Code, you need to work on summarizing, your going to get carpel tunnel way too fast, way too strong >:\


-KingTomato
Re: Mirc Help File ? #27667 03/06/03 06:13 AM
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Hey, it's 2AM, there is nothing on TV and I'm not tired... what else should I be doing? Oh and as for CTS, I've had it for years :P

Re: Mirc Help File ? #27668 03/06/03 07:17 AM
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Easy tiger! I'll answer this in a few days, I'm off to take a nice bus to my girlfriends house. Mmm.

BTW seeing mIRC migrate to a javadoc style online api would be nice, but perhaps a little useless

human goodness rant (was: Mirc Help File?) #27669 03/06/03 10:15 AM
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However, we aren't blessed with having hindsight until after the fact. You can't know what the ramifications of an action will be until you have taken the action.
History often (always) repeats itself. We've documented enough history to provide the sight of all hinds in the world.

The slaughter and sale of such animals could potentially bring considerable income to a nation that changed its stance on such issues, but in the interest of ethics and morality, most nations have not.
Most (all) nations DO profit from the slaughter and sale of native wild species UNTIL the animal becomes endangered. Usually for their pelts, and often with the excuse of 'nuisance animal', people are legally poaching wildlife this very second. I forgot the statistic, but how many animals become extinct each year? This is not from them eating eachother.

There are also things like protected land, for example in the US there is ANWR (Arctic National Wildlife Refuge) which is protected land, basically no one can touch it, and yes I know the status of this area is currently in question, but I feel like ignoring that fact for now.
This is a prime example of your government at work. Bush is actively trying to remove this protection status for the immediate and explicit purpose of Arctic Drilling.

You are jailed for murder, not for being a Good Samaritan.
You are only sued for millions for being a Good Samaritan. If someone is hurt, DONT TOUCH THEM. Lawyers will convince them that their chronic back pain was YOUR fault. By law, you cannot dispute someone who claims to suffer from back pain.

it isn't the US that is drilling everywhere for oil, it is organizations like OPEC.
The US doesn't have to drill for oil. We hire sand people for that. It's THEIR fault, you know. We may pay them, but they don't Have To accept the money. They could refuse and wait for us to wage war against them. (oh wait, we did that already)
You will never see hydro powered cars in your lifetime. They don't have the same performance that American drivers (and most people World wide) demand. Fuel efficiency is bad for business, thats why vehicles today suck more fuel than they ever did in history.

Smallpox
If 3/4 of Europe didn't die from the Black Plague, the world population would be at least 20 if not 200 times what it is today (assuming they lived equally fruitful and tragic times as the rest of us) If we found a cure for death, god help us. IMHO, abortions and assisted suicide is the most humane medicine we have today. Many children much rather be dead than living the foster system never knowing their mom... and I know if I were to become incapable of sh[b][/b]itting on my own, I'd want Dr Kevorkian by my side. Remember, spay and neuter your pets, and children, to lower the stray/homeless population. Its funny how it's suddenly different when we talk about population of people, not just animals. Nearly every species of wolf is extinct due to our advancements, I suppose because they're so dangerous to people (who aren't even close to extinct).

but I'd like to think that the majority of people have good intentions for their actions...
We'd all like to think that. It makes it so much easier to wake up in the morning.

Getting back onto topic...
Yes, it is Outlook Express's sole blame for these Email worms. It has nothing to do with HTML Emails, but has everything to do with permitting dangerous scripts to be executed when an email simply arrives in your mailbox. SARC has told us for years that such a phenomena is not possible and only Urban Legend... leave it to Microsoft to make it a reality.

As far as CHM over HLP, I think it's an equally unnecessary risk. CHM is just as obsolete as HLP. It's a disgusting program and a disgusting file format. It has security risks that are just not worth it. If we're going to switch formats, I'd recommend PDF. It's universal and 100% safe.

- Raccoon

PS. Closing philosophical / religious note.
"Thou Shalt Not Kill" was the 6th, shortest, and most simply put commandment. It is often mistaken as being the first or second commandment because of its powerful message. Four simple words with nothing to question and no mistakes to be made... so how after 2000 years did it translate to:
"Thou Shalt Not Kill, unless to feed thine hunger, or to wage war upon thine neighbor... but only if thou hast asked for my blessing first. When I am exceedingly busy doing God things, it is also OK for thou to carry out judgment upon thy neighbor, even if they have asked for my forgiveness. Killing in my name will always earn thee favor and acceptance into heaven. Just try to make it quick and painless."
PSS. No, I'm not a vegan or against the death penalty. I'm merely stating a point.


Well. At least I won lunch.
Good philosophy, see good in bad, I like!
Re: human goodness rant (was: Mirc Help File?) #27670 03/06/03 10:23 AM
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You sound like you'd like DDT reintroduced.


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Re: human goodness rant (was: Mirc Help File?) #27671 03/06/03 06:48 PM
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codemastr Offline
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Quote:
You are only sued for millions for being a Good Samaritan. If someone is hurt, DONT TOUCH THEM. Lawyers will convince them that their chronic back pain was YOUR fault. By law, you cannot dispute someone who claims to suffer from back pain.

Maybe in your country, but in the majority of US states there is what is called a "Good Samaritan Law" which states that you can not be held criminally or monetarily responsible for harm inflicted on a person while attemption to help them. Obviously exceptions exist, if an EMT decides to start rolling a guy with a back injury around, they can be held responsible, but that is because they have been given proper training in what should be done and have decided to neglect their training.

Quote:

You will never see hydro powered cars in your lifetime

Well then I guess I died 3 months ago, because I have seen about a dozen of them on the road in Los Angelas already.