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Popups not appearing in channel user lists

Posted By: Scott_Hibbard

Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 15/11/09 07:53 PM

I am running mIRC 6.35 on Vista Business.

popups.ini is located in Users\xxx\Appdata\Roaming\MIRC\scripts. I do not have any values in remote.ini.

The issue I have is that popups I've added to popups.ini are not appearing when I right click in the user list in channels I join. I can see the popups in Scripts Editor > Popups. The syntax looks correct to me but I might be missing something. The popups in question are the CUSTOM section below:


Info:/uwho $1
Whois:/whois $$1
Query:/query $$1
-
Control
.Ignore:/ignore $$1 1
.Unignore:/ignore -r $$1 1
.Op:/mode # +ooo $$1 $2 $3
.Deop:/mode # -ooo $$1 $2 $3
.Voice:/mode # +vvv $$1 $2 $3
.Devoice:/mode # -vvv $$1 $2 $3
.Kick:/kick # $$1
.Kick (why):/kick # $$1 $$?="Reason:"
.Ban:/ban $$1 2
.Ban, Kick:/ban $$1 2 | /timer 1 3 /kick # $$1
.Ban, Kick (why):/ban $$1 2 | /timer 1 3 /kick # $$1 $$?="Reason:"
CTCP
.Ping:/ctcp $$1 ping
.Time:/ctcp $$1 time
.Version:/ctcp $$1 version
DCC
.Send:/dcc send $$1
.Chat:/dcc chat $$1
-
CUSTOM
.GoodBye:/me bows and salutes out
.Wave:/me waves
.Salute:/me salutes
.Bows:/me bows
.Bow&Salute:/me bows and salutes
.ReturnSalutes:/me returns salutes
Posted By: RusselB

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 15/11/09 08:07 PM

Are you sure you are right-clicking in the nicklist?
I just copy/pasted the additional commands that you had added to my nicklist popups, which is where the rest of the popups that you have indicated are located, and they worked fine.
Posted By: Scott_Hibbard

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 15/11/09 08:59 PM

I'm absolutely certain that I am clicking in the nicklist.

I agree that the code should work. Others have tested it for me also using MIRC 6.35 and didn't have problems.

I've tried using others popups.ini files and can replicate the same behavior with their popups not appearing in the nicklist.

Thanks much!
Posted By: s00p

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 16/11/09 12:58 AM

If you are low on system resources the popups won't entirely display. Please close all other applications and let us know if that made any difference.
Posted By: DJ_Sol

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 16/11/09 06:14 AM

The issue is most likely the wrong file path.

Go to the directory Users\xxx\Appdata\Roaming\MIRC\.

Look for the mirc.ini file. Copy it and paste it in the same folder as the mirc.exe you are running.

This will make it so the directory for your files is the one mirc.exe is in. There won't be any question about the file path. Now you can enter your popups.ini in the script editor, or copy and paste your complete popups file to the folder mirc.exe is in.

Once you can verify the popup file is loaded it should work fine.

If you like you could also put the popup code in a menu bracket.

menu channel {

;example:
Popup:popup command

}

You would put this in a regular script file. (alt + R)
Posted By: qwerty

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 16/11/09 11:22 AM

So you're basically suggesting ruining the multi-user environment that mirc (or the user himself) has correctly set up and going back to the Windows 95 days... not to mention that writing to Program Files (most likely location of mirc.exe) is not even allowed on regular user accounts.

Multi-user issues have been discussed to death here, I hoped you'd be at least aware that there are such issues and would accompany your suggestion with some sort of disclaimer.
Posted By: s00p

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 16/11/09 12:07 PM

I agree with qwerty. I believe you have misdiagnosed this issue. There is no proof to support your claim that the cause is "most likely the wrong file path." There is, to the contrary, proof against this in that mIRC can actually access the popup script. If mIRC can access the popup script, what on Earth makes you think mIRC can't access the popup script?

menu nicklist would be far more appropriate. Please don't make a suggestion unless you have encountered this problem and are 100% sure you know how to reproduce it. I don't think a multi-user environment could cause this problem. However, I have had experience with missing menu items in many Windows apps (including mIRC) when system resources are low.
Posted By: DJ_Sol

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 16/11/09 10:49 PM

For the people who only run one mirc ever, the new default is fine.

For others who run multiple instances of mIRC or have issues with the file path, as this person obviously is, I suggest keeping the mirc's individual.

Don't think of it as reverting back win95. Insinuating that this method is old and crappy, like Win95, is wrong. I never suggested he run mIRC from the program files directory. If it were a practice you could equate to Win95 why would Khaled make sure to include it?

The reason is for people who run multiple mirc's. Also, I never liked having my files in some different folder. I like to have my files in the same directory or subdirectory as mirc.exe is in. I;ve had nothing but trouble trying to run mirc with scripts and variables in a different directory. I run 2 or 3 different mirc's with another for testing. I don't want them to share variables.

For those who run one instance of mirc and only use mirc features the default method is fine. And really, how many people have multiple user accounts that all use mirc? I know of no one in the 7 years I've been messing with mIRC. Not saying it isn't possible.

The issue he is describing, entering code into the remote editor but not seeing the results of my changes in mirc, sound like the same issues myself and friends have had with storing the scripts and such in a central directory as default now does.
Posted By: Darwin_Koala

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 17/11/09 05:47 AM

Running "-i" on the command line is an excellent way to run multiple instances of mIRC (only one installation required). Understanding this mechanisms allows maximum customisation of each instance of mIRC. The ^.ini file can be called whatever you want and stored whereever you want.

Cheers,

DK

Posted By: DJ_Sol

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 17/11/09 09:37 AM

That's cool to know thanks. Unfortunately I have a large user base that aren't all extremely savvy. I try to keep it all simple with no nonsense.
Posted By: s00p

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 17/11/09 12:48 PM

In relation to the thread, what is your point? I'm not sure what sort of rational (or irrational) thinking you went through to come up with the solution that you did, and now you're arguing in an attempt to suggest it's all simple with no nonsense. Would you please explain what makes you so sure this problem is related to multi-user configuration?

I see multiple instances of a single-user configuration in a multi-user environment to be extremely complicated by comparison to a single instance of a multi-user configuration that saves everything to the correct places. Do you also explain how to set privileges correctly for underprivileged users, so that the admin can expect basic changes such as nickname and colour themes to be saved after mIRC is closed? If not, how do you counter this problem?
Posted By: Scott_Hibbard

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 17/11/09 04:20 PM

All

Thanks greatly for your assistance with this.

Mirc.ini was in the roaming path (C:\Users\xxx\AppData\Roaming\mIRC) but mirc.exe was not. I moved mirc.exe to the default path and that did resolve the problem.

Thanks again for everyone's input!
Posted By: DJ_Sol

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 17/11/09 10:48 PM

OMG!! So the path was wrong!?!?! No way!!!


What you did is one solution. IF you only use one mirc.exe then that is just fine. smile

What I suggested offered the ability to easily have individual mirc's all with their own configuration settings and scripts.
Posted By: s00p

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 18/11/09 01:43 AM

crazy

why do I get the impression of Arnold Schwarzenegger facing off to Kerry O'Brien?
Posted By: Darwin_Koala

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 18/11/09 06:11 AM

Originally Posted By: DJ_Sol
... IF you only use one mirc.exe then that is just fine. smile

...


You should use only one mirc.exe and only run multiple instances using the "-i" switch on the command line (for your own usage), or mirc.inis in the user default application location (for multiple users /multiple accounts). Installing multiple mirc.exe just to run different profiles leads to configuration management problems - and potential conflicts if both .exes want to access the same file due to a conflict in the profiles.

After all, you don't in install MS Word twice, just because different users want to use a different normal.dotx!

Yes, I know it can be done - but it doesn't mean it should be done - and people who manage multiple users should understand how to install and run multiple user programs. You mention helping other users - what can be better than helping them to learn how to manage their access to programs in an efficient manner, and learning about secure implementation of both applications and personal configuration files.

In terms of being simple - nothing is simpler then a quick edit to the program shortcut (or copy thereof) to add the "-i" parameter. Certainly easier than multiple installs and managing the multiple exe files!

See "Command Line" in the help file and have a little experiment for yourself.

Cheers,

DK
Posted By: DJ_Sol

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 18/11/09 06:16 AM

Thats your opinion. smile You cannot compare mIRC to MS Office. Can you run Office from a memory stick without installing it? Why was this feature allowed if it is so bad?

People who manage multiple users can deal with their own issues or ask for help. This thread has nothing to do with people who have multiple user profiles.

I do not provide a shortcut. I provide script files and mirc.ini in the same directory.
Posted By: CtrlAltDel

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 18/11/09 06:03 PM

Quote:

You should use only one mirc.exe and only run multiple instances using the "-i" switch on the command line (for your own usage), or mirc.inis in the user default
DK


I disagree. I currently have 7 different folders for 7 different users on one of the computers in my house (running Windows7 and all are mIRC6.35). Each folder has it's own mirc-username.exe (copied from an install folder that is not used), and all of these copies have their own settings, and scripts. NONE of them use the AppData folder, as all are created in the root directory (C:\mirc-username for each).
Posted By: Darwin_Koala

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 18/11/09 07:11 PM

Glad it works for you, but not best practice. You now have to maintain 7 installs. By using one install and appropriate shortcuts you only have to maintain one install - the shortcuts won't need to be changed anyway.

What you are demonstrating is a level of trust in your other users. You have allowed them free access to the C:Programs folders. In your circumstances that may be acceptable but I certainly don't recommend it as a default stance. And I don't think those who help others should either, as it breaks the "rules" on least priviliges (which helps with security and prevention of malware).

Cheers,

DK
Posted By: DJ_Sol

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 18/11/09 07:23 PM

Oh, you misunderstand me.

Not user groups. Different people all over the world.

edit: Pardon me I didnt see ctrl+alt+del's post
Posted By: s00p

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 18/11/09 10:45 PM

Originally Posted By: DJ_Sol
Thats your opinion. smile You cannot compare mIRC to MS Office. Can you run Office from a memory stick without installing it?


1. This is getting grossly off-topic. Just a hint, or a suggestion...
2. You still haven't answered my question, which questions the relevance of this apparent solution.
3. I have a memory stick that is 16GB.

Originally Posted By: DJ_Sol
Why was this feature allowed if it is so bad?


It's not so much "allowed if it is so bad" as "vaguely supported due to past development". I wouldn't be all that crushed if Khaled were to cripple this feature, because I've had absolutely no problems running mIRC properly with multiple users. In the coming years I expect it, because Microsoft is moving on...

Originally Posted By: DJ_Sol
People who manage multiple users can deal with their own issues or ask for help. This thread has nothing to do with people who have multiple user profiles.


I agree. This brings me back to my initial, unanswered question.

Originally Posted By: DJ_Sol
I do not provide a shortcut. I provide script files and mirc.ini in the same directory.


Originally Posted By: CtrlAltDel
I disagree. I currently have 7 different folders for 7 different users on one of the computers in my house (running Windows7 and all are mIRC6.35). Each folder has it's own mirc-username.exe (copied from an install folder that is not used), and all of these copies have their own settings, and scripts. NONE of them use the AppData folder, as all are created in the root directory (C:\mirc-username for each).


Originally Posted By: DJ_Sol
Oh, you misunderstand me.

Not user groups. Different people all over the world.


Regardless, these posts have the same issue. I noticed DK has already mentioned it. When a new version of mIRC is released, you now have 7 copies to update. This is merely annoying.

Aside from this, a properly secured Windows environment shouldn't extend write permissions for underprivileged users beyond their "home directory", and should only use Administrator access to install software and device drivers to the appropriate area (rule of least privilege DK mentioned). If this model is strictly adhered to, hacker, viral and badware attacks can be kept from reigning supreme with no more than a firewall. If you allow writing of new files (scripts, downloads) to the mIRC program files directory the "welcome home" mat for a potential virus/hacker attack widens. This is far more annoying, because as well as having 7 home directories to search for compromisation, you now have 7 mIRC directories too.

Security is not difficult to provide, and it can be provided with expected functionality at the same time.
Posted By: CtrlAltDel

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 20/11/09 04:59 PM

to Darwin_Koala also:
I do not allow users "free access to the C:\programs" folders .. they have free access to their own folder (C:\ctrlaltdel\ is one of them, the rest are also in the root directory, and also named for the individual user). As for updating, I install to the C:\mircversion folder (example: c:\mirc635) and simply copy/paste the new .exe file and help files (as necessary).
I fail to see how this is "bad practice" .. I have total control over the scripts in each folder (not all the same), which keeps them from loading scripts they don't need.
If they were in "one install" the scripts would be available for everyone which in MY opinion would be a security risk since I personally use scripts that the others have no business even seeing.

To each his own, I guess.
Posted By: Darwin_Koala

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 20/11/09 08:50 PM

Perhaps to each his own. But you still have some misconceptions in your thinking, or are perhaps following an outdated model for the storage of files or applications.

The application can be in one folder (read only to all except the admin - yourself?). Thus, your users cannot overwrite the application with a rogue app (accidently, unwittingly, deliberately, whatever).

The main (individual) ^.ini file (mirc.ini) and any associated script files can be in the user's own folder. When you do "one install", the script files do not have to be available for everyone. The location of script files is held in mirc.ini and customisable - this is the strength of the "-i" command line parameter.

You can still use common script files (only one version needed) which you control - if you wish. Users can create and load their own script files in addition.

I argue that a proper multi-user install and configuration will give you more control and will give your users both better customisation and security than the model you are currently using.

But, as you say - each to your own. I am merely trying to point out some of the better practices that are available, practices that are enabled by improvements in the operating system.


Cheers,

DK
Posted By: s00p

Re: Popups not appearing in channel user lists - 20/11/09 10:43 PM

Originally Posted By: CtrlAltDel
to Darwin_Koala also:
I do not allow users "free access to the C:\programs" folders ..
good
Originally Posted By: CtrlAltDel
they have free access to their own folder
why? An attacker gets an entire directory tree that they can write to, making possible compromisations slightly more difficult to find. Think about it: 7 installs, 4 or 5 directories each... 28-35 directories to search for files that may very well be hidden as .mp3 or even .dll files (not to mention the countless other directories that are within the users home dir). Heck they may even modify the .exe file so you can't load mIRC in Admin, or your entire system is bunked!
Originally Posted By: CtrlAltDel
(... As for updating, I install to the C:\mircversion folder (example: c:\mirc635) and simply copy/paste the new .exe file and help files (as necessary).
You are doing alot more work than I do. Simply install the new mIRC straight over the top.
Originally Posted By: CtrlAltDel
I fail to see how this is "bad practice" ..
The practice of installing separate copies for each user isn't a bad one, though it can be quite wasteful (particularly if you're talking about Microsoft Word). Failure to notice a serious compromise is a bad practice.
Originally Posted By: CtrlAltDel
... If they were in "one install" the scripts would be available for everyone which in MY opinion would be a security risk since I personally use scripts that the others have no business even seeing.
Not if you go through the trouble of setting up the user accounts in the control panel. If you have solely restricted account using mIRC, they shouldn't be able to modify the program files directory, so they'll save all of their data (.ini, scripts, downloads, etc) into their userdir. They won't be able to access each others scripts, or modify mIRCs core files (do not confuse with mIRCs settings files, which would be stored in the user's home dir somewhere).
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