Ok, so i'll check those out then, I went to the ircle website, but i didnt download it.. I dont have , the DSL on the mac yet but im working on it, atm im busying making my own IRC network which will soon be open to the public. I havent yet figured out who im making admins or anything like that so for now, it will be a good sturdy small network if your interested in needing a new place to chat let me know.