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A tutorial to teach people to script in mIRC #25299 21/05/03 05:46 AM
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BoredNL Offline OP
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The reason for this is because many people have a hard time when begining to script because after learning the basics, whenever they want to do ANYTHING in mIRC, they have to take their best guess at what the command may be or what text may be in the help for that command specifically, or they have to search through the entire help file for it or something that will do the job.

One feature that would be nice if included would be example scripts.

A tutorial would show people how to script correctly, efficiently, and would allow for people to learn to script and start more easily.

Note: I'd create a tutorial, but I'm not an expert scripter, nor do I know how to create a well made tutorial.

A possible benefit from this to the whole mIRC community would be that more people would probably start scripting. The scripts created by these scripters (who were taught to script correctly and efficiently) would most likely be a lot faster and probably more innovative and diverse.

'Methodology' could be taught in the tutorial as well to show different techniques for certain situations and which ones have been proven to work well.

Now of course the main function of this tutorial would just be to streamline the process of teaching someone to script (efficiently script). The 'methodology' wouldn't have to be implimented, and if it is, it should be implimented as notes at the bottom of a page or as part of an extended tutorial. Example scripts would be an extra added bonus and not required either.

If I just made a fool of myself and I'm missing something crucial here, please let me know. smile


- Wherever you go there you are.[color:lightgreen]
Re: A tutorial to teach people to script in mIRC #25300 21/05/03 07:13 AM
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Flippy Offline
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/help example script
laugh


Seriously though, the mIRC help file is an *excellent* source of documents on scripting. I myself learned scripting solely from this file, with no examples save the ones provided in there.

Many of mirc's functions are intuitively named - for example, /window opens up a window wink If you want to do something, and do not know how, a quick search through the mirc help file will usually tell you all you need to know.

Re: A tutorial to teach people to script in mIRC #25301 21/05/03 11:11 AM
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starbucks_mafia Offline
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If people want to see examples of how certain things are scripted there are thousands of scripts of varying size and complexity available on dozens of websites on the net. Isn't that one of the key points of open source - that anyone can see and learn from what's already been created?


Spelling mistakes, grammatical errors, and stupid comments are intentional.
Re: A tutorial to teach people to script in mIRC #25302 21/05/03 09:16 PM
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Doqnach Offline
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you always use google to search for tutorials!


If it ain't broken, don't fix it!
Re: A tutorial to teach people to script in mIRC #25303 21/05/03 10:11 PM
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BoredNL Offline OP
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You guys obviously missed the point I was making there..

The help file, although it is good, and it does help people to script, it does not necessarily guide them and teach them how to script correctly and efficiently. They force people to "reinvent the wheel".

There are many "tutorials" for Macromedia Flash as well, but they pretty much all of them suck. The one that comes with Macromedia Flash, however, was created by people who know how to use the program well and know how flash files should be created, not "how someone figured out how to do it".

An official tuturial could also be the culmination of the effort of many people, not necessarily like what a lot of other tutorials are like, which are created soley by one person and are grossly incomplete.

I'm not saying that all tutorials that come with programs are better, so don't argue that with me. The Macromedia tutorial was simply an example.

What I'm saying is that it is logical to conclude that a "centralized tutorial" recieves more work and the several other various tutorials usually don't recieve as much attention and aren't as detailed.

I've searched for tutorials for mIRC before and they usually just tell me things I already know.. They don't teach people to script the way they should.. It's just usually junk.. I've seen some that actually teach people the wrong way to script..

Ok, my concentration has gone to 0.. (3 of my friends came over). I'm going to end my post here. If it's disorganized, I apologize.. My brain just became scattered though.. lol

If anyone knows of any good tutorials, please let me know about them. I'd appreciate it.


- Wherever you go there you are.[color:lightgreen]
Re: A tutorial to teach people to script in mIRC #25304 22/05/03 04:30 AM
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CloCkWeRX Offline
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I suggested something similar, "scripting standards", and got lynched - but don't listen to the nay-sayers. At the moment I'm working on a site (MEAR) which will focus on teaching a particular style of scripting which helps to people use mIRC in an OO way, despite the fact its most definately not an OO language.
If any of you want to see, try to find me on irc.telstra.com, in #mirc - I'll show you what i've got so far and would glady welcome new submissions.

If you don't want to put up your tutorials, maybe you could gimmie hosting space (PHP 4.3.X + mySQL), as coolfreepages seems stuck in the dark ages of PHP4.0.6. Either way, as it nears completion, I'll probably fork money outta my own pocket and put it up.

If I don't get it up(poor choice of words, isn't that?) the tutorials will be released on mIRCscripts.org as a wham-bam-thank-you-mam package. They will/do focus on anything from basic scripting, right up to com objects, writing DLLs, sockets (UDP), project management, project planning, good GUI design, and "where did I put my monkey" etc etc etc.

Re: A tutorial to teach people to script in mIRC #25305 22/05/03 11:12 AM
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Raccoon Offline
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I'll write a tutorial... and a damn fine one. 50+ pages, covering every element of scripting and teaching you how to think and script efficiently... but it will cost you.

- Raccoon


Well. At least I won lunch.
Good philosophy, see good in bad, I like!
Re: A tutorial to teach people to script in mIRC #25306 22/05/03 11:40 AM
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starbucks_mafia Offline
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I don't think that we're losing out from a lack of scripting tutorials on the 'right way' to do things because there is no right way.

If I make something thats 20 lines, someone else can probably mess with it and make the same thing in 16 lines that is faster for some people, or someone will come along and write a DLL that does the same thing 3x faster. But does that mean my original way wasn't perfectly fine? Maybe even better because the code was more readable?

There's usually no 'best way' to do things in programming, there's almost always a trade-off between speed, readability, re-useability, and size. Besides, this is mIRC scripting, not many people are really interested in the what someone else decides is the best way to do something, they just want something that works. This is also the reason why people were less than enthusiatic about Clockwerx's scripting pseudo-standard suggestion - most people use mIRC script because it's simple and fun. Standards and people deciding how things should be done just makes scripting less fun and often needlessly complex.


Spelling mistakes, grammatical errors, and stupid comments are intentional.
Re: A tutorial to teach people to script in mIRC #25307 22/05/03 10:04 PM
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BoredNL Offline OP
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As I said, the main purpose for the tutorial would be to teach people to script in a streamlined manner. The tutorial would teach people to script 'efficently' by probably showing common pitfalls and such.

Although I agree that it can be argued that there is no "wrong way" or "right way" to script exactly. Usuaully some ways of scripting are better than others for most instances.. That you can't argue against. :P

Btw dude.. Your example doesn't pertain to all instances of what could occur as it seems to be presented as doing.. I also did not say that the tutorial couldn't show more than 1 way of scripting.. As with any tutorial, it tells the user that there ARE different ways of scripting..

You also shouldn't speak for others, because it's obvious that there are people who would like to see a good tutorial included with mIRC.. Of the 6 people who are included in this topic so far, 2 of them agree with the idea, 2 of them don't, 1 of them posted a suggestion as to how to find a tutorial (uh?), and one offered to write a tutorial for a price.. If this was a ballot, it'd be 50% for, 50% against, and the other third of people wouldn't have voted..

I did not mention DLL programming, did I? I was talking about mIRC scripting.. Learning to program dll files was something clockwerx suggested, not something I did. (although I think for an 'advanced' section, that would be a wonderful addition to the tutorial)

Also, is anyone going to hold a gun to anyone's head to read the tutorial and script the way it says? How would it make scripting less fun? It would make scripting easier.. The whole reason why scripting is fun is because of what you can do, not because you have to search around the entire mIRC help file.. (unless you have an S&M relationship with your mIRC help file.. *chuckle*) Do you think the "Command List" link on mIRC's webpage is there because people find it very easy to look through the mIRC help file? uh, no. :P

mIRC is a very popular chat client that a lot of people script in, in my opinion, because it much easier to script in than it is to create progrrams in C++ or whatever.. You can start scripting simple and useful scripts immediately after reading a few pages of the help file. There is not much "overhead" to learn before one can script. What a tutorial would do would remove uncertainty and eliminate all of the wasteful time spent by someone looking all over the help file for something to use.

I don't see how a tutorial would have any adverse effects.. Because anyone who doesn't want to use the tutorial, just wouldn't.. And there'd most likely be no stigma attached to mIRC for the person who just simply doesn't use the tutorial..


- Wherever you go there you are.[color:lightgreen]
Re: A tutorial to teach people to script in mIRC #25308 22/05/03 11:57 PM
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CloCkWeRX Offline
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*chuckles* no stigma? Sit in help desk and wait for a n00b to ask a question that's incredibly obvious, again & again, then watch the hackles rise on the helpers.

"RTFM!" would be yelled at them so often they'd have nightmares about it...