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Mostly harmless
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I was wondering if a network founder is able to read the log of a query between two other users or read the log of a DCC chat.
Does it depend on the server version or something?

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Fjord artisan
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No they can't spy on DCC sessions.
DCC = Direct Client Connection
With DCC you're connected directly to the other persons
mIRC, the IRC server is used only to initiate the DCC session.

As far as spying on private messages, not only is this totally
possible, but it happens a lot, there has been a conversation
about this very subject here.

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Hoopy frood
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I wouldn't say it happens "a lot". You are safer from staff abuse however on the larger networks, they are (generally) run more professionally.

Regards,


Mentality/Chris
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Fjord artisan
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You're right, "a lot" was a bit strong, but it happens more
than most might think, especially on the smaller networks.
They seem to have more than enough time on their hands
to try that stuff and eventually get bored with it as opposed
to the large networks whos staff has their hands full already
without worrying about what users are saying in private.

Last edited by mIRCManiac; 16/03/05 05:10 PM.
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Hoopy frood
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The size of the network and how much time opers have on their hands has nothing to do with it. It all comes down to one thing and one thing only, the ability of server software to allow spying on private messaging. There's hundreds of networks with less than 500 concurrent users where this would simply not be possible unless someone with programming knowledge modified the software. The network I use has between 500 and 1000 concurrent users, still could be called a small network going by those numbers and we use commercial software - read: spying on private messaging is not possible on there.

Catagorising networks the way some of you have simply hinders the growth of small networks and nothing else.

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Fjord artisan
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~ Edit ~
Nevermind. It's pointless really.

Last edited by mIRCManiac; 21/03/05 02:54 PM.
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Hoopy frood
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Any server can be made spy-accessible, whether you have the daemon source code or not.


Spelling mistakes, grammatical errors, and stupid comments are intentional.
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Hoopy frood
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And you've achieved this I suppose?

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Hoopy frood
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It takes little more than a packet sniffer (such as ethereal), which simply dumps network traffic - regardless of the degree of commerciality of the programs generating this traffic. All you need is administrator/root access on any of the computers involved in sending, receiving or forwarding the packets (read: the kind of access that an admin of an IRC server would have).


Saturn, QuakeNet staff
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Hoopy frood
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shhhhhh be quite about ethereal you want everyone to know !?!?!??!

Honestly everyone it doesnt exist, and if it does, I have never used it, and If I have, I didnt use it yesterday, and if i did I didnt do anything bad, and if i did, well ummm sue me.

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Hoopy frood
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Jokes aside wink ..there is nothing intrinsically unethical about packet sniffers; it comes down to how you use them... Comparable to, for example, Swiss knives.


Saturn, QuakeNet staff
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Hoopy frood
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on a ethereal related question, you got any idea how to expand gzip packets, i cant read them, so i have the http requests going out, but compressed http pages coming back in that i cant read, tis mighty annoying.

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No idea I'm afraid, sorry smile I don't use it that often...


Saturn, QuakeNet staff
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Hoopy frood
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I am aware of what a packet sniffer does. We are talking about IRCd's though. I am just wondering how Starbucks manages to think that using a closed source commercial software as a spying tool is easily achievable if the function isn't originally part of the software. Maybe he is right - I am just curious.

I ask from the perspective I am looking at. I oper on a network that uses commercial closed source software, installed in a data centre the size of Kingdom Come, accessible only by a select handful of technicians and perhaps ASIO and the AFP.

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Hoopy frood
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To me it appeared that you were stating that the use of commercial software would prevent spying on private messages, which is obviously not the case. After this post I guess you meant something else, although I'd say that the actual method of getting the private messages on one's screen (whether it be a command in the IRC daemon, or a packet sniffer) is irrelevant to the issue at stake here.

I guess Mentality meant that larger networks tend to have a stricter acceptance policy and more mutual scrutiny when it comes to servers and admins, whereas pretty much anyone can set up a small IRC network with their own rules and ethics. This is a probability, though, and I'm more than willing to trust you on the fact that spying on private messages does not happen on your network. But this has everything to do with the people involved in administering and maintaining the servers, not with the type of IRCD software used.


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Hoopy frood
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We're not talking abour IRCds, we're talking about servers. A server is not a single peice of software, it is a peice of software running on a computer, providing service to clients, There can be any number of additional layers of hardware and/or software between the daemon itself and incoming client traffic. The nature of the licence for the daemon software changes absolutely nothing about that situation. Therefore, the IRCd in use on any given IRC server is irrelevant as to whether it may be spying on it's users. This is the point I was/am making and, from the way I interpreted your original post, directly contradicts what you were saying.


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