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#101119 20/10/04 05:51 PM
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since every year per version there are added many new commands i think that MS help file now literarly sux !

you choose from "index" some title to find and then again you need to list it from beggining of the file...

i would suggest new type of Help file, in my taste the best should be something HTML based but not to fill folder with bunch of files and pictures, why not compile it in ebook ?

then when you click on some "title" you will be automaticaly linked to correct postition of "help"...
and new images for examples would be great.

itz not that i am lazzy to browse, but it becomes annoying over time.

Last edited by Wragg; 20/10/04 05:53 PM.
#101120 20/10/04 06:15 PM
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.HLP files can contain anchors, the mIRC helpfile simply doesn't use them. Type /ircintro for an example of one that does.


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#101121 20/10/04 06:41 PM
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this suggestion is more than for Anchor
MS help file is ugly, and you cant input big pictures so all at the end looks nice...

if you compile an ebook, then it looks like webpage on maximized window (better) and it is an .exe file
you can add many pictures (any size) and it will look ok.
you can choose any font type any color type and it will look good.

IMO ebook is far more suitable than .hlp

and as seen, people were complaining about bad made help file with minimum examples and help. no pictures as visible example... nothing...

or it is time for Help file creator to stop being -edit- and make good .hlp file or make next step and make it even better.
and i guarantee you that it WILL reflect on users in big way

Last edited by Mentality; 20/10/04 08:12 PM.
#101122 20/10/04 06:48 PM
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Using an exe ebook just means someone has to code an entirely new interface, a search facility, an indexing feature, bookmarking, history, annotations, etc.. The reason that help file formats exist is, surprisingly enough, for help files. The fonts looks fine, and keeping with the familiar look of .HLP files is a good thing for the same reason that having programs all use the same Windows GUI instead of creating custom ones is a good thing. .HLP files can contain images just fine, not that images are really necessary for 99% of what the helpfile contains.


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#101123 20/10/04 06:55 PM
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in that case author should consider in making BETTER help file instead to make other people to make new one from zero because authors lazzyness

itz a discrase

#101124 20/10/04 06:57 PM
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Make it better how? I'd like to see anchors, and there are about a dozen omissions, but besides that I don't see the problem. Hardly a 'discrase'.


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#101125 20/10/04 07:04 PM
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>Make it better how?

anchors, more examples + other things i havent noticed and other ppl want...

#101126 20/10/04 08:17 PM
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You're entitled to your opinion, but please convey it to others in a polite way, and without insulting anyone - including Khaled.

You may be interested in this project.

Regards,


Mentality/Chris
#101127 22/10/04 05:21 AM
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what about the help in .html format? at least in the webpage, a link to download it.

i like html.


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#101128 22/10/04 11:04 AM
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itz a discrase

As is your attitude and spelling. I am not the hardcore mIRC scripter I once was and indeed I admit to forgetting many things relating to it. It's a pain because it means I have to spend time refreshing my memory and the best way to do that in this case is to read the mIRC help file, which in reality can be regarded as 99% complete.

Have you ever written a help file? It's not always easy or quick to do, a bit like teaching your woman how to cook. :tongue:

mIRC.hlp is 215k. It's not big but not small either and given that mIRC is a diverse and feature-packed programme these days, laziness can hardly be used as a reason for attacking the author for alleged incompleted work. Look at it this way... What in this world can be regarded as "complete"? When you think hard enough about it, nothing is because life is an evolutionary cycle and things change in size and substance every day.

#101129 22/10/04 09:30 PM
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Quote:
Have you ever written a help file? It's not always easy or quick to do, a bit like teaching your woman how to cook.


author of help file does NOT write it from begining every time when new version of mirc is released, if he/she/it have been more "hard working" and made basic things in the begining that make its use easier and better, it wouldnt be hard NOW for small upgrades on new controls/commands and since mirc was developed since early 199x years i think there was plenty of time for something like this... dont you ?

Quote:
laziness can hardly be used as a reason for attacking the author for alleged incompleted work


then what ? too little time for upgrade ?
right...

Quote:
Look at it this way... What in this world can be regarded as "complete"? When you think hard enough about it, nothing is because life is an evolutionary cycle and things change in size and substance every day.


tell that to people that spend money for this

#101130 22/10/04 10:38 PM
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You still haven't said what you think is so wrong with it at the moment. 'Lack of anchors' is hardly a major problem (if you're really bothered you can define your own bookmarks for commonly used places) but it would be nice, and 'more examples' - more examples for what exactly? Most commands and identifiers don't need examples because they're simple. Give some examples yourself of places where you think documentation is lacking.


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#101131 22/10/04 10:56 PM
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Quote:
Most commands and identifiers don't need examples because they're simple


it would be good for pure beginners (noobs) some basic examples no mater if it is SIMPLE to understand or not

Quote:
Give some examples yourself of places where you think documentation is lacking.


not my job is it...

#101132 22/10/04 11:12 PM
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If I remember there are examples in the help file, and the
Quote:
Give some examples yourself of places where you think documentation is lacking
Quote:
not my job is it...
then what's the point in posting about it if you arent willing to try to help it happen? It would be nice for a revamped help file although i beleive it should stay in the basic format it is since thats the standard.

#101133 22/10/04 11:19 PM
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Quote:
Quote:
Give some examples yourself of places where you think documentation is lacking.

not my job is it...

- No it's not your job, but I don't think it's too much to ask that you give a clear example of the problem you're complaining about and what sort of thing you'd like to see done about it, is it?


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#101134 23/10/04 07:42 AM
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Why do you sit there stripping people's posts to the bone in some vain attempt to demonstrate superiority, which I might add is clearly lacking. No-one here, to my recollection, ever stated that the help file is written from scratch at each version update infact it is clearly recognised that it is merely added to on each occasion.

The help file is there to provide help. It is not intended to be a fancy looking 'versions.txt' file and shouldn't be intended for that purpose. As such not everything that is changed will be recorded in the help file. Yes, there is one or two things missing that some may require help for. No-one is disputing this. However it is a bit rich to exclaim that 'people pay for this' because $20 isn't exactly a backbreaking sum of money - it barely buys me half a tank of petrol thanks to the greedy oil companies. mIRC, thankfully, lasts alot longer.

Unless you are prepared to lose the 'not my job' attitude and help provide an adequate (to all of us) solution for your problem then you can hardly expect support when you complain.

#101135 23/10/04 08:20 AM
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then leave it like this forever and after 3-4 years it will be just dandy

#101136 23/10/04 12:52 PM
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if the help file was bigger and better people wouldn't need to post here and argue like this

#101137 23/10/04 04:32 PM
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This is not a reply to you.

What does it matter what anyone thinks about another person's feature suggestion?

I don't quite understand the fuss about the Feature Suggestions forum from time to time, like with that "colors" thread. Khaled, and Khaled only, decides what gets put in the next version, so who cares what others think?

Dear Khaled, I personally would also like to see the help file anchored.

Oh, and thanks so much for developing mIRC, I love it to bits.

Greets


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#101138 23/10/04 05:40 PM
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If khaled wants a feature, then he'll add it, but if he doesn't want it (or isn't bothered) then the opinions of people could help him decide whether it's worth the effort.

For example: if only one person wanted a bigger/better help file, then he probably wouldn't consider it worth the effort.
Anchoring the help file would be a complete pain, it is a fairly big help file after all.


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